Dutchman/Voltage Quality Contol

[wildwest450]

I've completely given up on worrying about the 200 things wrong with my camper, and started concentrating on saving it myself. With the major stuff fixed, i'm taking care of the many smaller items that need attention. Like my "enclosed underbelly" that had a giant gap in it all the way across the back, leaving an exposed plywood edge. A tube of black Proflex Rv fixed it up nice. Next is to reseal all the lower trim that is already peeling off, dummies used silicone...



Sorry to the op for the hijack.

[RVNevada]

Thanks Wino, I got a call from our dealer and have an appointment for June 16, 2015, Next time I may go to Gateway, we will see??

[Chapmon]

Originally Posted by Real Hummer

Because what started out as a few small things led to bigger things. The dealer is 2 hours each way and did not want to drive that far to drop it off then go back. Another reason is the old saying if you want things done right better to do it yourself. Last night I decided to install the upgraded water pump and another issue, all the water lines are very sloppy and 3 or 4 were way to long causing them to kink and loss of volume. Its not that the coach is not usable but no pride in any ones work.

Upgraded water pump? Is this an upgrade that you chose to add (if so,please enlighten me) or did you have a defective water pump, too?

[sweet overkill]

Everyone that keeps fixing things themselves, you make Dutchmen happy! As long as they don't have to fix things they will keep putting out junk I'm sure the letters you send them about the things you have to fix just get thrown in the garbage. Has anyone reported them to the Better Business Bureau? We are in the process of the lemon law with them.

[Soccerloco]

Unless it's something major I'd rather repair myself. With Rv's traveling is what you do. I want to know how to fix most things and the best way to do that is getting your hand dirty. Maintaining is very important and yet another way to learn. Personally I've had very few issues But I use my rv a lot so I know that things will come up

[RVNevada]

Sweet Overkill:

I agree with you on the Large repair items, but I don't want to wait for the Dealer, first to make an appointment, then bring it there for months…..Beside the letter sent, I think that as a group we should help those that have a lot of big items to repair….If we could change just the Quality Control before the unit comes to the Dealer, I think it would make most of us happy.

Rich

[Soccerloco]

Rich
Right totally agree. Since I use my rv for work I can't afford to have it down for months. I am sure my reaction if I was told it would take months to repair something..... I would go bonkers
Bill

[Real Hummer]

Originally Posted by Chapmon

Upgraded water pump? Is this an upgrade that you chose to add (if so,please enlighten me) or did you have a defective water pump, too?

chose to install a water pump with more GPH 6.0 versus 3.5 and pressure 55psi instead of 40 or 45 with a tank & bladder so the pump isnt running all the time.

[wahoonc]

Originally Posted by sweet overkill

Everyone that keeps fixing things themselves, you make Dutchmen happy! As long as they don't have to fix things they will keep putting out junk I'm sure the letters you send them about the things you have to fix just get thrown in the garbage. Has anyone reported them to the Better Business Bureau? We are in the process of the lemon law with them.

BBB is a joke and I am beginning to believe that RVIA is one too. Dutchmen and quite a few other companies could care less, they are selling RV's that is ALL that matters to them.

Aaron

[ewacowboy]

I just had a couple of warranty issues addressed at a local Keystone dealer. What I've discovered are two things:

1- Keystone acquired Dutchmen so we're really dealing with Keystone.
2 - Any warranty issues after the PDI must be presented to Keystone for approval, which may take a few hours to a few days.
3 - The repair tech told me that there aren't any QC folks at the plant. They ship these coaches to the dealers and expect them to QC and report/repair any items.

I had a few more issues that I wanted repaired under warranty so I asked them to take pictures and submit them for approval. When all are approved I'll make another appointment to have them repaired, which shouldn't take more than a day. All-in-all I've been fairly pleased with the warranty repair process. Just requires patience....which I'm trying hard to have.

[13DenaliDually]

Originally Posted by Real Hummer

chose to install a water pump with more GPH 6.0 versus 3.5 and pressure 55psi instead of 40 or 45 with a tank & bladder so the pump isnt running all the time.

Can you show some pics of the new pump and tank? What brands and cost if you don't mind?

[Aztex]

I also wish that they would do QC before they leave the factory. However, after coming from a large Class A to the ToyHauler, I really can't see much difference in RV manufacturers. Our coach was in and out of the shop until the day we traded it in. I believe that it is the large number of continual small items that really wears on you. All in all our 3970 is great.....we are looking for many good years with the rig. We have had great success in working with Lippert on the remote....they even stayed after hours to make sure we had the fault analyzed and corrected. Hopefully Dutchmen's suppliers are all like that.

[Real Hummer]

Originally Posted by Aztex

I also wish that they would do QC before they leave the factory. However, after coming from a large Class A to the ToyHauler, I really can't see much difference in RV manufacturers. Our coach was in and out of the shop until the day we traded it in. I believe that it is the large number of continual small items that really wears on you. All in all our 3970 is great.....we are looking for many good years with the rig. We have had great success in working with Lippert on the remote....they even stayed after hours to make sure we had the fault analyzed and corrected. Hopefully Dutchmen's suppliers are all like that.

Congrats on your new purchase. I love ours also but if they would just give it that little extra!!! I finally after 2 weeks had Dutchmen call me over my issues, I doubt I will take it to the dealer as I am not at all happy with the dealer anyhow, Grumbines RV. I cant see driving 2 plus hours each way to have it sit there for who knows how long. I will continue to fix and make improvements myself and maybe the end of the season take back to have the tub replaced.

[Chapmon]

Originally Posted by Real Hummer

chose to install a water pump with more GPH 6.0 versus 3.5 and pressure 55psi instead of 40 or 45 with a tank & bladder so the pump isnt running all the time.

Thanks for the information. Something I will have to consider.

[Pushin4u]

Real Hummer, we had similar issues with our 2015 3800... everything from bathroom door handle on with the lock on outside of door, to a missed nail through the main bed frame sticking out about an inch into the bed making it look like a mouse chewed the mattress. A little QC would go a long way with me!!!

[xhogboss]

One service writer told us, "If you don't have a nail or screw through a pipe or into an electrical bundle, you're lucky"! The only brand he's never seen problems on is Airstream. Apparently they are constructed one at a time by a dedicated team - pride in workmanship goes a long way.


And you're right, you travel in these things. We're full-timing. Getting an appointment several weeks in advance is really difficult when we're not sure where we want to be. Good dealers have a long waiting list, and the not-so-good - well, probably don't want to take the rig there anyway.

[Pirate]

Well, I learned with our 2010 Jayco T29A that you have to be willing to learn your RV and work on your RV to be successful and enjoy your outings.

We have had fewer issues with the 2014 Voltage Epic 3800. But there are still a few.

I went as far as to purchase the extended warranty...but learning that it really means nothing. I will only use it for appliance failures if they occur. Fridge, stove, microwave, water heater, furnace, AC units, ceiling fans, happi-jack system, electric convertor, fireplace...and that's about it. The rest, I continue to learn and do myself.

If something happens on an outing, it will be good to have the experience to fix all the small stuff!

I seem to be experiencing issues with a lot in life now. And I'm not sure of the root cause.

Is it because wages are stagnant and CEO's make hundreds of times what middle management does, let alone the hourly worker?

Is it because a lot of the talented, dedicated workers are baby-boomers who have learned they didn't plan for retirement and "have" to work?

Are things really that different than 10 or 20 years ago? I dunno.

Pirate

[xhogboss]

Yes, things are different. When I entered the job market many, many years ago, workers tended to stay with a company long-term. Also, many workers had military experience that gave them structure and allowed them to see the value of discipline. They seemed to understand that their contribution helped the employer and that the employer was then motivated to help them.


My experience, for what it's worth, with younger people entering the profession with which I was associated was their focus on 'what can the company do for me'. Couple that with the mobility we didn't have 40-50 years ago. People change locations, jobs and houses more often.


Part of it may be the way the folks building these rigs are compensated. The same service writer told me the factory paid 'by the screw' - the more of these units they cranked out - the more $$$ they can make. I can't confirm that's the real picture, but it makes sense from what I've seen in my rig. Could be also that for what they are paid, more highly-motivated or more capable workers simply look elsewhere.


Every manufactured product has a price point - what the consumer will pay. And it may be the case that these units couldn't be sold for what a robust quality control program would cost. I always have to wonder why it makes business sense for the manufacturer to pay twice (or more times) to correct something that should have been done correctly the first time.

[Pirate]

You make some good points. Last week there was an article of automakers spending 8.5 billion to build assembly plants in Mexico. The article's final sentence was a Ford vehicle made in Mexico costing $700 less than a comparable Chevrolet made in America.

I cannot believe Americans won't pay the $700 to keep the jobs in the USA.

Are wages really that stagnant? Part of me says yes, that's what I experienced in my 35 year career. And then there was all the benefits going away and becoming my cost. And all the while the top 10 people in the corporation were nearing or above $1 million a month. UGH!!

Pirate

[Chapmon]

Most Americans would gladly pay the $700 to keep the jobs in America. Americans are not given the chance. The ruling class that makes those decisions and pockets to $700 per vehicle make those choices for us. It is not about us saving money, it is about them making money.