Black Waste Water Valve leaking - Dutchmen Owners

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Old 01-22-2016, 04:14 PM   #1
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Black Waste Water Valve leaking

Fairly new voltage bought new from Dealer in Texas (btw would never deal with them again) but in fairness I hear similar stories and in my opinion, its all about the service department. Anyway, hoping the post is worth it to someone and to myself for any suggestions. I took it to a service dealer prior to warranty going out at a year with the black tank valve leaking and in the repairman's manipulation, the handle or cable broke. They replaced it with a cable style waste valve and I called them again to verify that they did replace it and of course I can see the bonding and cuts(that weren't all that great back to like new) on the underbelly covering, and yet it still leaks. I am not sure if it leaked from the moment of the repair, but even if it did, at this point, I am wanting it done right and maybe even better than original to avoid the frozen brown slushy I had to deal with this past weekend. Though I have installed an external valve, as long as it leaks water from the black tank valve, at least in winter freezing weather, I have got a problem.

I need suggestions on taking down the underbelly…

electric vs replacing valve or just the seals?

use the flush king or similar external device first to verify nothing actually stuck in the valve mechanism?

Does anybody else have the same problem due to the location of the valve on the voltage 3200 and use of the cable? and why did my cable rust/ break?

Assuming I get it to not leak from the inside valve, will it prevent the frozen poop/sewer material if I am keeping the trailer temp at a certain degree heat (usu I use between 62-67)?

also, I am not fulltime so probiotics do not have time to dissolve any products on my jaunts.

thx
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Old 01-22-2016, 06:47 PM   #2
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Wil

The smallest piece of debris can stop the valve from completely sealing. I always flish the black tank about twice as long as I think it needs to be flushed.

The problem with the cable activated valves is with the install. The cables are usually way too long for what is required. They often get wedged in between something causing them to bind and premature failure. They are also not given any anchor points, as a result you have to overcome the movement caused be the slack. That could also cause the valve not to open and close fully.

Open the hole they put in the bellypan and see if there is alot of freeplay in the cable. If there is look for some place you can anchor the cable and see if that helps.

Several folks on the forum have changed over to the electric valves and swear by them.

Jim
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Old 01-22-2016, 08:33 PM   #3
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Leaking valves...

Leaking black and grey water valves, at the tanks seems to be fairly common. I had that issue with all four tanks in my 2014 Voltage Epic 3800.

The reason you have had, and still have issues with the cable pull valves is this: The valve comes with a cable that is 8 ft long. From the "wet cabinet", on mine, the distance to the bath black valve is about 4 ft. The distance to the kitchen grey water valve is about 3 ft. The cable cannot be shortened, cannot be lubricated, and the rest of the cable is left wadded up under the trailer.

I changed mine to Valterra electric valves. I have a post on here that you can search for that gives a pretty good process for how I did mine. Really not that difficult and work just great.

I also put a Valterra twist on valve, like you I believe, on the end of the waste piping. That way if I was to get some leakage...it doesn't get to me. I can twist on the drain piping, then pull the twist-on valve open...and voila, no mess.

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Old 01-22-2016, 08:47 PM   #4
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great stuff guys; any suggestions on repair of the underbelly/ material or upgraded hatch system for future maintenance. also gonna check out the electric valves but any issue with running out of batter or do you run power directly from trailer battery or is there an override.

Pirate, you are right though I am not sure what brand the outer twist on valve is, but it is great added protection but allowing any water to leak from the inside valve resulted in what I had this weekend, the inability to empty with a brown water frozen wall when I was finally able to thaw the handle to the outer twist on valve. I have considered foregoing any replacement of cable or valves and simply devising a heating wraparound cable for the outer three inch pipes but felt like that wouldn't be too clean as well as liable to tear off during travel or just normal wear and tear. Do you know if anyone has done that approach? Meantime, I'll check out your other post.

thx again
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Old 01-22-2016, 08:54 PM   #5
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If your underbelly cover is like mine, the "plastic cardboard", you can buy it in 24"x36" sheets at Home Depot. Now, my underbelly is black, the Home Depot material is white. So what.

I cut 4" wide strips of the material, the length of my cutouts and put the center of the strip down the cut line.

Then used a bit of liquid nails and a box of 3/4" sheet metal screws to close up the cutout. I put the screws on each side of the underbelly cut about 2" apart. That seems to be holding very well.

Tried "gorilla tape" to hold things together...supposed to be good stuff...it ain't. The wind started pulling it off in just a few miles.

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Old 01-22-2016, 09:16 PM   #6
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hullflyer2 they make valve, pipe and tank heaters no need to cobble something up.

I have used these gate valve heaters from Ultra Heat in the past, down to around zero with great results. Make sure you DON'T run them unless you are hooked up to power of some sort.

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Old 01-23-2016, 06:00 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pirate View Post
If your underbelly cover is like mine, the "plastic cardboard", you can buy it in 24"x36" sheets at Home Depot. Now, my underbelly is black, the Home Depot material is white. So what.

I cut 4" wide strips of the material, the length of my cutouts and put the center of the strip down the cut line.

Then used a bit of liquid nails and a box of 3/4" sheet metal screws to close up the cutout. I put the screws on each side of the underbelly cut about 2" apart. That seems to be holding very well.

Tried "gorilla tape" to hold things together...supposed to be good stuff...it ain't. The wind started pulling it off in just a few miles.

Pirate
That's what I use. If the color is a problem you can find coroplast in black, but who is goning to see it. Or you could give it a coat of rocker gaurd.
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Old 01-23-2016, 08:30 PM   #8
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Or just a little plain ol' black spray paint! But I decided, why bother?

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Old 01-23-2016, 11:19 PM   #9
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Hullflyer 2, Until you decide which way you want to go on the valves, Pick up a Valterra Twist-On Valve from camping world, Part # 27868 on sale for $25.19, so you can still use your RV
Rich
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Old 01-24-2016, 02:51 AM   #10
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Rich, no doubt the twist on valves are a great idea. I got mine before the electric valve replacement...and then chose to leave them on...just in case!!

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Old 01-24-2016, 04:38 PM   #11
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Smile

I still have my Valves on also...
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Old 01-24-2016, 06:46 PM   #12
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pirate even if old, incredible post on the electric valve replacement. I reviewed it and let me echo the others in saying attaboy. will try it when a little warmer. appreciate aaron's suggestion on the outside drain pipes for a little stick on heat. either going with some heat tape for right now or running the heat sheets into a thermacube outlet to come on at 35 and off at higher temps.
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Old 01-24-2016, 11:44 PM   #13
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Glad you found the post helpful! Its not that big of a job. I did both in half a day...so crawl under there on a heating pad or old electric blanket and get 'em done!!

And for goodness sake, don't melt the piping with heat tapes....

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Old 01-27-2016, 11:40 PM   #14
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Finally replaced my leaking black tank valve with the Valterra electric unit, largely guided by Pirates tutorial. I chose to remove the nails/washers that held the underbelly up and drop the whole thing back to the leading axle on our V3605. Grab the nail head with vice-grips and twist a little - they come right out. Replaced them with self-tapping screws and fender washers.

I ran into a small issue with the shape of the existing flanges - they had a shallow pyramid-shaped protrusion between the bolt holes, so the bolt holes on the valve couldn't line up.Filed about 1/8" off and it was smooth sailing after that. Had to cut the 3" ABS drain line downstream from the valve, and used a 3" no-hub fitting to mend it.

Checked function of the old valve after removal - gate wouldn't close even with the handle against the cable sheath. Bad design from the start.
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Old 01-28-2016, 12:54 AM   #15
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Glad you got the job done! I reworked my drain piping to move it forward a couple of feet. So its not quite a simple replacement, but it doesn't take that much to do.

And the results are more than worth it!!!

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Old 01-28-2016, 04:07 PM   #16
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Glad you got the job done! I reworked my drain piping to move it forward a couple of feet. So its not quite a simple replacement, but it doesn't take that much to do.

And the results are more than worth it!!!

Pirate
I agree on moving the sewer connection from under the slide. Figured I'd do that when I replaced the grey water dump valve.

Word of warning to those who wish to do this: be prepared for all sorts of construction debris when you open the bellypan, and have lots of wire ties handy - you'll need them.
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Old 01-31-2016, 05:35 PM   #17
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Well long story, but same issues with dump valves. Black was leaking but I use a sewer valve on the dump pipe anyway just to be sure, then the cable broke. One of the gray valves was also sticky and then the valve got stuck in the closed position. I was so fed up that I had all 3 valves replaced with electric and I am so much happier and it is so easy to dump the tanks now. After all this, I remembered that my fresh water dump valve is under the slide and a pain to open, so next up is to put in an electric valve for that one as well. Go electric, you will not be disappointed. These crappy cables they put in and their poor craftsmanship when they put this stuff together is a joke.
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Old 01-31-2016, 10:19 PM   #18
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ranbud,

Valterra does make an adapter kit to use the 3" electric valve on the smaller fresh water dump valve.

Glad you are happy...who needs that kind of frustration????

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Old 01-31-2016, 10:39 PM   #19
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Agree with you there! Why crawl under the slide to operate that valve or the gray valve for that matter.
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