Why do tires fail?

[franktafl]

Originally Posted by Tireman9

I suggest you re-read the tire sidewall. It probably says "Sidewall one ply Polyester, Tread one ply Polyester, 2 steel plus 1 nylon"
Since it is the air pressure that supports the load not the tire structure I see no reason why the tire could not support your Denali. If you doubt this could you explain how all tires are covered by Load & Inflation tables. There are no Load & construction tables.


RE the latest pictures. Better but maybe posting results in degradation. I did mark up a shot with what looks like melted body cord.

I kind of thought you would TRY to find something. You are REACHING and, again, not !

[aguablanco]

So I see this discussion has evolved into two camps. The science camp says that most tire failures are caused by abusing the tires by any number of ways. This camp is backed up by decades of research, empirical evidence and direct observation by highly trained professionals.
The other camp, I am not sure what designation they should have, believes that tires made in certain countries are inherently bad no matter what. They have used anecdotal evidence, "feelings" and a very small set of unsubstantiated/non-reviewed data to state their case. While many claim to have had issues, even with extremely good care, they refuse to accept an experts opinion on the root causes of the failures.

As I have read virtually every one of Tireman's blog posts on RV tires I will have to accept his wisdom and knowledge on this issue. FYI, I have had "china bombs" on my trailers, cargo and RV, for many years and never had a problem. I run a TPMS and visually inspect the tires at least daily. I also use the infrared thermometer at most stops looking for temp differences. I will continue to read and follow Tireman's recommendations for the foreseeable future. Thanks for all of the info Tireman.
RichH

[azdryheat]

Originally Posted by aguablanco

So I see this discussion has evolved into two camps. The science camp says that most tire failures are caused by abusing the tires by any number of ways. This camp is backed up by decades of research, empirical evidence and direct observation by highly trained professionals.
The other camp, I am not sure what designation they should have, believes that tires made in certain countries are inherently bad no matter what. They have used anecdotal evidence, "feelings" and a very small set of unsubstantiated/non-reviewed data to state their case. While many claim to have had issues, even with extremely good care, they refuse to accept an experts opinion on the root causes of the failures.

As I have read virtually every one of Tireman's blog posts on RV tires I will have to accept his wisdom and knowledge on this issue. FYI, I have had "china bombs" on my trailers, cargo and RV, for many years and never had a problem. I run a TPMS and visually inspect the tires at least daily. I also use the infrared thermometer at most stops looking for temp differences. I will continue to read and follow Tireman's recommendations for the foreseeable future. Thanks for all of the info Tireman.
RichH

Not "certain countries" just CHINA. I checked 80 trailers at our store and 4 of them had blown a tire coming from the factory. That's 1 in 20 trailers of current inventory experiencing a failure coming from the factory. On a used trailer I saw a blown spare tire that had never touched the road. Saw another mounted on the rear of a trailer, with a tire cover installed, and it blew a hole in the cover. These were all CHINESE made tires.

I'm glad you haven't had any tire issues and hope you don't have any. For me I'll stay far away from CHINESE tires and warn everyone that I can about the dangers they pose.

[franktafl]

Originally Posted by aguablanco

So I see this discussion has evolved into two camps. The science camp says that most tire failures are caused by abusing the tires by any number of ways. This camp is backed up by decades of research, empirical evidence and direct observation by highly trained professionals.
The other camp, I am not sure what designation they should have, believes that tires made in certain countries are inherently bad no matter what. They have used anecdotal evidence, "feelings" and a very small set of unsubstantiated/non-reviewed data to state their case. While many claim to have had issues, even with extremely good care, they refuse to accept an experts opinion on the root causes of the failures.

As I have read virtually every one of Tireman's blog posts on RV tires I will have to accept his wisdom and knowledge on this issue. FYI, I have had "china bombs" on my trailers, cargo and RV, for many years and never had a problem. I run a TPMS and visually inspect the tires at least daily. I also use the infrared thermometer at most stops looking for temp differences. I will continue to read and follow Tireman's recommendations for the foreseeable future. Thanks for all of the info Tireman.
RichH

I refuse to accept an expert's opinion due to the fact that I am basing my experience on actuals. If he were to agree with my point or any other's point about these tires, he would open himself to all sorts of issues as "the subject matter expert". Who knows, his blog may even be sponsored by these folks, you never know.

I accept the fact that the tires, if abused (in many ways) can fail. I accept the fact that their QC may be more lacking in certain aspects. My point of view is that the RV industry is going to utilize products manufactured by the lowest bidder. The tires come on the trailer when the RV "assembler" gets the chassis before assembly and there is always the drive to cut costs and improve profits. Someone will be injured by these things, a lawsuit will probably entail then the truth may be known.

I respect your opinion, you are entitled to it. Maybe you should respect mine and many others like me that have NOT addressed this sensitive issue.

Frank

PS: those were not melted, they were frayed! They just came apart.

[azdryheat]

I just bought some Hankook Kinergy ST tires for my single axle trailer used to haul my RZR. Sidewall says they're made in Indonesia. We'll see how well they hold up.

[aguablanco]

Originally Posted by franktafl

I refuse to accept an expert's opinion due to the fact that I am basing my experience on actuals. If he were to agree with my point or any other's point about these tires, he would open himself to all sorts of issues as "the subject matter expert". Who knows, his blog may even be sponsored by these folks, you never know.

I accept the fact that the tires, if abused (in many ways) can fail. I accept the fact that their QC may be more lacking in certain aspects. My point of view is that the RV industry is going to utilize products manufactured by the lowest bidder. The tires come on the trailer when the RV "assembler" gets the chassis before assembly and there is always the drive to cut costs and improve profits. Someone will be injured by these things, a lawsuit will probably entail then the truth may be known.

I respect your opinion, you are entitled to it. Maybe you should respect mine and many others like me that have NOT addressed this sensitive issue.

Frank

PS: those were not melted, they were frayed! They just came apart.

Speaking of respect, how does implying that Tireman is "compromised", ostensibly, by not agreeing with your assertions and may be "compromised" by phantom sponsors show any respect? How does my statement that I will trust science and peer review show disrespect to anyone on this forum? And, please, do not claim to represent the silent majority on this forum. If others have NOT addressed this issue it may be because they see the tactics being used to deflect from Tireman's report and not wish to be attacked as others have been on here. Just because someone doesn't comment does not imply they agree with any one viewpoint. It may mean they are trying to learn more.
RichH

[franktafl]

Originally Posted by aguablanco

Speaking of respect, how does implying that Tireman is "compromised", ostensibly, by not agreeing with your assertions and may be "compromised" by phantom sponsors show any respect? How does my statement that I will trust science and peer review show disrespect to anyone on this forum? And, please, do not claim to represent the silent majority on this forum. If others have NOT addressed this issue it may be because they see the tactics being used to deflect from Tireman's report and not wish to be attacked as others have been on here. Just because someone doesn't comment does not imply they agree with any one viewpoint. It may mean they are trying to learn more.
RichH

obviously, you have not been a victim of one of these mishaps. have a good day.

[aguablanco]

Originally Posted by franktafl

obviously, you have not been a victim of one of these mishaps. have a good day.

As I stated earlier, I have been fortunate to not encounter one of these mishaps. However,I don't see how that has any bearing on the matter at hand. Anyway, hope you have a great weekend.
RichH

[franktafl]

Originally Posted by aguablanco

As I stated earlier, I have been fortunate to not encounter one of these mishaps. However,I don't see how that has any bearing on the matter at hand. Anyway, hope you have a great weekend.
RichH

Because if you did, your attitude would be different.

[aguablanco]

Originally Posted by franktafl

Because if you did, your attitude would be different.

My acceptance of scientific data is in no way dependent upon anecdotal evidence. While anecdotal evidence may begin a process of research and exploration, it will not provide the conclusions necessary to make an informed or educated decision as to cause. I may well have a blowout in the future, and when that happens I will look to Tireman for a sound, scientific and reasonable explanation to help avoid future issues.

RichH

[franktafl]

Originally Posted by aguablanco

My acceptance of scientific data is in no way dependent upon anecdotal evidence. While anecdotal evidence may begin a process of research and exploration, it will not provide the conclusions necessary to make an informed or educated decision as to cause. I may well have a blowout in the future, and when that happens I will look to Tireman for a sound, scientific and reasonable explanation to help avoid future issues.

RichH

one way or another, it will be your fault!

[Osprey767]

I have a Kodak2015 298Rlsl that I bought second hand. It is in great condition but the right front tire show considerable more wear than the other three. Do you think this is because of low pressure at some point or alignment? The spare is like new so plan on moving it to replace worn tire. Should I rotate the tires?
Thanks

[ArmyVeteran]

Originally Posted by Osprey767

I have a Kodak2015 298Rlsl that I bought second hand. It is in great condition but the right front tire show considerable more wear than the other three. Do you think this is because of low pressure at some point or alignment? The spare is like new so plan on moving it to replace worn tire. Should I rotate the tires?
Thanks

Check the online pictures and charts or take the tire to a good Dealer and let them give you an opinion.

[ArmyVeteran]

[acdii]

Originally Posted by Osprey767

I have a Kodak2015 298Rlsl that I bought second hand. It is in great condition but the right front tire show considerable more wear than the other three. Do you think this is because of low pressure at some point or alignment? The spare is like new so plan on moving it to replace worn tire. Should I rotate the tires?
Thanks

If it is evenly worn, chances are the trailer was loaded heaviest on that corner, so it had the most work and wear. Check the tread depth of the diagonal opposed tire and compare to the other three. If it has slightly more tread than the rest, then it could be due to the weight distribution.





One thing to do for all is to get an Infrared thermometer. Carry it in the truck with you and every time you stop after driving a while, go measure the tire temps. Measure the hub temps too. It is a good habit to get into, and after a couple trips you will know what the temps should be and know right away if you have an impending tire failure, or hub failure and get it corrected before it becomes a problem.

[azdryheat]

More proof that trailer tires are junk. Taking a tire and bearing temp reading every time you stop for a break? Do you point the heat gun at the truck's tires and bearings, too? Let me ask this. When we hop in the family car and take a trip do we constantly take tire temp readings? Do we pay extra attention to the family 'truckster' tires? I don't. When I take the 400 mile trip from Tucson to San Diego in my Toyota Highlander I check the car and tires before we leave and that's it. Same thing when we go to Branson MO. And since I don't run garbage Chinese tires on my toy hauler that's all I do with it too. Haven't had a tire failure issue in the 5 years I've had the tires. I've never had a bearing failure.

I don't worry about my bearings because they were properly packed and properly installed - by me. When I repacked the bearings on the small, used trailer I haul my RZR with I had to use a wrench to back off the castle nut. The bearings showed signs of heat damage so they were replaced. Previous person doing the bearings didn't know what he was doing.

I have peace-of-mind knowing that my trailer's tires aren't going to fail and that my bearings are properly packed and installed (because I did the work).

[franktafl]

Out of an abundance of caution, I do a walk around and touch the tires and the hubs when I stop somewhere for fuel or something like that. I DO NOT check the pressure (probably recommended by some here) when I stop for a break and neither do I check pressures when I leave after spending a week somewhere. I changed my tires to some quality stuff and every time I check them, they are spot on.

I stated my opinion of a certain country's tires and got criticized for speaking my mind. I believe that it is dangerous to ask or recommend to someone that these particular tires are safe but I do recommend changing them at your earliest opportunity... for peace of mind. I am sure the experts will weigh in and dispute what I say but the proof is in what I have personally seen.

If the tires are showing abnormal wear, I would get the alignment definitely checked when you replace the tires and check to see that the braniacs at the factory put the axles on correctly.

[acdii]

Originally Posted by azdryheat

More proof that trailer tires are junk. Taking a tire and bearing temp reading every time you stop for a break? Do you point the heat gun at the truck's tires and bearings, too? Let me ask this. When we hop in the family car and take a trip do we constantly take tire temp readings? Do we pay extra attention to the family 'truckster' tires? I don't. When I take the 400 mile trip from Tucson to San Diego in my Toyota Highlander I check the car and tires before we leave and that's it. Same thing when we go to Branson MO. And since I don't run garbage Chinese tires on my toy hauler that's all I do with it too. Haven't had a tire failure issue in the 5 years I've had the tires. I've never had a bearing failure.

I don't worry about my bearings because they were properly packed and properly installed - by me. When I repacked the bearings on the small, used trailer I haul my RZR with I had to use a wrench to back off the castle nut. The bearings showed signs of heat damage so they were replaced. Previous person doing the bearings didn't know what he was doing.

I have peace-of-mind knowing that my trailer's tires aren't going to fail and that my bearings are properly packed and installed (because I did the work).

Actually I do take the truck tires temps. It is something ingrained in me from my days driving OTR. I take hub, brake and tire temps when towing on all wheels. When not towing though, I don't since there is no heavy loading as there will be when towing or hauling.



It takes a minute, it works the kinks out of my legs and back at the same time, and lets me know if anything appears abnormal well before anything can happen, and it makes no difference if I did the work and know I did it properly or not. A seal can give out at any time regardless if it was done properly or not. A cold drum out of 4 is an indication of a seal leak, even if the hub is normal temp. It can also signal that there could be a broken wire to that drum possible from kicking up debris on the road.



If you don't want to, then don't, just giving out some good advice to others of a quick simple walk around that takes a minute or less for good peace of mind.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[ArmyVeteran]

And other stuff. No opinion from me, just offering up as info.



https://www.hagerty.com/articles-vid...1_Weekend_News




Go all the way down to opinions. This one is good.





"Then there’s the guy who read that most accidents occur within five miles of home, so he moved."