Frozen water lines

[BigTex]

Ok, so I have found the point where my waterlines will freeze up. 12⁰ and 30 mph winds did the job and it happened a lot faster than I thought it would. Completely fine to completely frozen in about 10 mins.

So, anyone got any good ideas on how to thaw out the waterlines going to the kitchen and back bathroom in a voltage? Anywhere I need to be watching in particular for a possible busted line once I do get it to flow?

What's the best way to prevent this going forward? It's nowhere near as cold as it will get in this region by the time winter is over.

[franktafl]

Originally Posted by BigTex

Ok, so I have found the point where my waterlines will freeze up. 12⁰ and 30 mph winds did the job and it happened a lot faster than I thought it would. Completely fine to completely frozen in about 10 mins.

So, anyone got any good ideas on how to thaw out the waterlines going to the kitchen and back bathroom in a voltage? Anywhere I need to be watching in particular for a possible busted line once I do get it to flow?

What's the best way to prevent this going forward? It's nowhere near as cold as it will get in this region by the time winter is over.

Portable electric heaters in the wet bay and bathroom. I use the oil type radiator in the bathroom-no flame or exposed elements.

[sundancer 87]

Wind speed doesn't have any affect temperature, the chill factor only works on humans that causes them to think it's so cold.


Heaters will keep parts of the interior warm but they won't do anything for water lines that are below floor level and in the walls.


The answer to your question is to winterize the unit. The manufacturer will tell you the unit is not designed to be lived in with temps less than freezing.

[persistent]

Good advice above.

Use a hair dryer to thaw pipes if you can get to them. Let water flow a trickle when temps are low.

Pull the belly cover. Add tank heaters. Heat tape around both fresh water and drain lines.

Seal frame to floor. Close off spaces without water. Insulate frame rails, bottom, and cross members. Replace belly cover and seal to frame.

If furnace heat flows to belly, make sure the wet spaces have flow through and return air to cabin above.

While you are at it, tie wires into bundles and protect where they pass over edges.

Plumbing inside spaces may have cold spots. Wheel wells may be steel and may be not be insulated. Modify the spaces so air can flow through. Close off plumbing areas from other cold spaces like pass through.

Move further south.

[sundancer 87]

Originally Posted by persistent

Good advice above.

Use a hair dryer to thaw pipes if you can get to them. Let water flow a trickle when temps are low.

Pull the belly cover. Add tank heaters. Heat tape around both fresh water and drain lines.

Seal frame to floor. Close off spaces without water. Insulate frame rails, bottom, and cross members. Replace belly cover and seal to frame.

If furnace heat flows to belly, make sure the wet spaces have flow through and return air to cabin above.

While you are at it, tie wires into bundles and protect where they pass over edges.

Plumbing inside spaces may have cold spots. Wheel wells may be steel and may be not be insulated. Modify the spaces so air can flow through. Close off plumbing areas from other cold spaces like pass through.

Move further south.

In other words, rebuild the thing and insulate it like one would do in a residence that has been properly constructed.

[BigTex]

Originally Posted by sundancer 87

Wind speed doesn't have any affect temperature, the chill factor only works on humans that causes them to think it's so cold.


Heaters will keep parts of the interior warm but they won't do anything for water lines that are below floor level and in the walls.


The answer to your question is to winterize the unit. The manufacturer will tell you the unit is not designed to be lived in with temps less than freezing.

I recognize that wind speed doesn't affect the temp a chemical goes through state change, but it does make a difference in how well we can keep a space warm if it isn't completely air tight. The underbelly is sealed, but not completely air tight by any stretch of the imagination.

At 15 degrees, I can keep the living space 68⁰ no problem. When if the wind is howling, 55 is the best I can do unless I put additional sealing material at the slide lips (yeah it's time for new seals).

Everything is thawed now, and I have a game plan going forward, but we're going to struggle a little bit this winter. Man, this spring is going to be busy with all the upgrades I have planned. For example, the builders *could* have ran the water going to the kitchen/back bath through the sub floor for about 6 feet between the stairs and the sink but instead decided to run it 15 feet between the fresh tank and frame and then diagonally over to the sink. That's just not going to work.

There's just no easy way to make this rig truly winterproof without serious modifications. It can be done, but it's not a quick fix type situation. "Arctic package".......what a joke.

Lol, maybe all the modifications I'll be doing
will fight the depreciation. I doubt it, but I can hope lol.

[muddfish]

Originally Posted by BigTex

I recognize that wind speed doesn't affect the temp a chemical goes through state change, but it does make a difference in how well we can keep a space warm if it isn't completely air tight. The underbelly is sealed, but not completely air tight by any stretch of the imagination.

At 15 degrees, I can keep the living space 68⁰ no problem. When if the wind is howling, 55 is the best I can do unless I put additional sealing material at the slide lips (yeah it's time for new seals).

Everything is thawed now, and I have a game plan going forward, but we're going to struggle a little bit this winter. Man, this spring is going to be busy with all the upgrades I have planned. For example, the builders *could* have ran the water going to the kitchen/back bath through the sub floor for about 6 feet between the stairs and the sink but instead decided to run it 15 feet between the fresh tank and frame and then diagonally over to the sink. That's just not going to work.

There's just no easy way to make this rig truly winterproof without serious modifications. It can be done, but it's not a quick fix type situation. "Arctic package".......what a joke.

Lol, maybe all the modifications I'll be doing
will fight the depreciation. I doubt it, but I can hope lol.

I covered my 3970 with Visqueen plastic and sat 2 Flood lights under the rig. this kept my lines from freezing and I used this while in New York during one of the worst winters and other places as well, Visqueen is cheap if you don't have skirting. My next plan is to drop under belly and winterize my winterized Rig

[Ponchharper]

Originally Posted by BigTex

Ok, so I have found the point where my waterlines will freeze up. 12⁰ and 30 mph winds did the job and it happened a lot faster than I thought it would. Completely fine to completely frozen in about 10 mins.

So, anyone got any good ideas on how to thaw out the waterlines going to the kitchen and back bathroom in a voltage? Anywhere I need to be watching in particular for a possible busted line once I do get it to flow?

What's the best way to prevent this going forward? It's nowhere near as cold as it will get in this region by the time winter is over.

I have covered mine with medium size insular ion circles tubes from hose to unit seems to work

[Randy]

I have an Outdoor RV trailer now, with the winter package. I called them expecting just one night to be down to 27F, and asked about what a single electric heater might do. They said I would need to turn the furnace on. I winterized it instead.

[elfaqua]

First thing to do is keep the heat in the belly/frame area where the lines are. Do this by sealing with caulk, the areas on the frame where the hydraulic lines and electrical lines come out of the frame for the leveling units and electrical lines.


Second, put a heater in the basement area and run it 24/7. If you can, get a 12V blower (Like a boat bilge type blower off of Amazon) and where the PEX lines go from the water pump to the lower frame area, drill the appropriate hole and mount and wire the blower. This will take your hot air from the basement and pump it down to the frame area.


You should be good to go with these simple mods.....

[sundancer 87]

Originally Posted by elfaqua

First thing to do is keep the heat in the belly/frame area where the lines are. Do this by sealing with caulk, the areas on the frame where the hydraulic lines and electrical lines come out of the frame for the leveling units and electrical lines.


Second, put a heater in the basement area and run it 24/7. If you can, get a 12V blower (Like a boat bilge type blower off of Amazon) and where the PEX lines go from the water pump to the lower frame area, drill the appropriate hole and mount and wire the blower. This will take your hot air from the basement and pump it down to the frame area.





You should be good to go with these simple mods.....

What hot air in the basement? Hot air rises if there is any to rise. One little three inch duct that is two miles too long won't put much warm air down there let alone hot air.

[elfaqua]

If you put a 1500 watt space heater in your basement area, it will get pretty warm. By using a Boat Bilge blower blowing down in the frame area, it will push that heat and keep the pipes from freezing as long as the heat cant escape through the holes in the frame where the lines come out.


Seaflow also makes 320CFM bilge blowers that will move more than enough air into your frame area. The other alternative is to install a Xtreme Heater brand in the frame area which are specifically made for permanent installation in a RV or boat.



The key is to keep the heat from escaping. I have fully insulated my 3895 in the frame area with Rockwool Brand Insulation and we camp at 20 degrees with no issues. And keeping the inside at 68-72 is no issue either.

[BigTex]

Originally Posted by elfaqua

First thing to do is keep the heat in the belly/frame area where the lines are. Do this by sealing with caulk, the areas on the frame where the hydraulic lines and electrical lines come out of the frame for the leveling units and electrical lines.


Second, put a heater in the basement area and run it 24/7. If you can, get a 12V blower (Like a boat bilge type blower off of Amazon) and where the PEX lines go from the water pump to the lower frame area, drill the appropriate hole and mount and wire the blower. This will take your hot air from the basement and pump it down to the frame area.


You should be good to go with these simple mods.....

Ya know if the hot air wouldn't have to go all the way around 3 tanks to get to the area I am most concerned about, this would probably work fine. I have a space heater in the basement already, but a small one. It really doesn't need the space heater to be honest. The water heater and the furnace are both in the basement and keep it pretty toasty already. I'll just replumb to make the run in the frame (I'll call it the belly) shorter and add heat tape with insulation. I just won't leave it plugged in all the time. I thi k woth just insulation I should be able to just let her drip/trickle in the worst times and be fine. If it does freeze, plug it in and let it thaw. I'll end up having to put in a second set of low point drains, but whatever. That doesn't bother me. I really don't foresee needing low drain points in the next few years. I use antifreeze to winterize lines for cold drives.

This all may be a moot point next week when I get my skirt put on. Just adding a skirt may do the trick.

[elfaqua]

I think you're on the right track. The skirting will probably fix all of your problems. When I removed the chloroplast bottom, the one thing that worried me was the back bathroom water lines were literally 1" from the frame. I encompassed them in poly spray foam and I also insulated the complete frame with the Rockwool Insulation. I also do believe that just plugging the holes in the frame to keep the heat in/cold air out will go a long way to keep the lines from freezing.

If you want to remotely monitor the temperature down there in the belly, Amazon sells these Bluetooth thermometers that will give you a good idea whats going on. I installed 3 of them in the A/C coil sides so I would know what the temperature of the air coming out of them during the summer would be. I had to recharge 2 of the 3 A/C's so I installed them just for piece of mind. I have not installed one in the belly/frame area yet but plan too. Batteries last about a year in them. They are $11.89 each.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Good luck! Post some pics when you get a chance of the skirting.