Bad Overweight by 10960 lbs - Dutchmen Owners

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Old 03-18-2014, 09:05 PM   #1
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Bad Overweight by 10960 lbs

Ever since Arlan brought my attention to the Fifth Wheel ST I have been trying to understand all the terms and get all the info together so I could use the Fifth Wheel ST Calculator. I weighed my rig the other day at a CAT scale and when I later tried to enter the data I found that I needed to weigh just my TV by itself. So...Back to the scales and another $10 to weigh my TV. I know now I could have done a reweigh for $2.

The only thing I could find for the GCWR was in a PDF file on the Fifth Wheel ST website was under Tow Ratings-->Silverado which showed my GCWR as 20500. Can this be right? I've weighted several times during the past 6 months and I've always been over 30,000 lbs. That GCWR gives me the following report on the Fifth Wheel ST Calculator.

TV Weight W/Trailer Attached: 12440
TV Weight: 8880
Trailer Kingpin Weight: 3560
Trailer Gross Weight: 22580
TV and Trailer Combined Weight: 31460
Vertical Load (Kinpin): 16%

SAFETY MARGIN VS. OVERLOAD
TV Front Axle Weight: -480
TV Rear Axle Weight: -2055
TV Gross Weight (GVW): -560
TV Combined Weight (GCW): +10960
Hitch Tow GTW: +2580
Vertical Load (Kingpin): -1440
Trailer Gross Weight (GVW): +3580

I hope I am plugging in some bad numbers somewhere.

Have I got to shed 11,000 pounds? or maybe just 3600 pounds? HELP!!!
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Old 03-19-2014, 12:32 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slb5146 View Post
Ever since Arlan brought my attention to the Fifth Wheel ST I have been trying to understand all the terms and get all the info together so I could use the Fifth Wheel ST Calculator. I weighed my rig the other day at a CAT scale and when I later tried to enter the data I found that I needed to weigh just my TV by itself. So...Back to the scales and another $10 to weigh my TV. I know now I could have done a reweigh for $2.

The only thing I could find for the GCWR was in a PDF file on the Fifth Wheel ST website was under Tow Ratings-->Silverado which showed my GCWR as 20500. Can this be right? I've weighted several times during the past 6 months and I've always been over 30,000 lbs. That GCWR gives me the following report on the Fifth Wheel ST Calculator.

TV Weight W/Trailer Attached: 12440
TV Weight: 8880
Trailer Kingpin Weight: 3560
Trailer Gross Weight: 22580
TV and Trailer Combined Weight: 31460
Vertical Load (Kinpin): 16%

SAFETY MARGIN VS. OVERLOAD
TV Front Axle Weight: -480
TV Rear Axle Weight: -2055
TV Gross Weight (GVW): -560
TV Combined Weight (GCW): +10960
Hitch Tow GTW: +2580
Vertical Load (Kingpin): -1440
Trailer Gross Weight (GVW): +3580

I hope I am plugging in some bad numbers somewhere.

Have I got to shed 11,000 pounds? or maybe just 3600 pounds? HELP!!!
I'll try to help. There is no way you can be over that much. Here is one of my reports for comparison. We need to figure out if you put the correct numbers in.

My 2103 F 350 Dually has a GCWR of 30,500. I don't see how your truck could be 10,000 less.

In this report I am over 100 and that is only for the trailer. On edit. This was a good weight report for me I was not over but still under 100 pounds. I have been as much a 1020 over though.


Report

TV Weight W/ Trailer Attached: 13080
TV Weight: 9980
Trailer Kingpin Weight: 3100
Trailer Gross Weight: 18900
TV & Trailer Combined Weight: 28880
Vertical Load (Kingpin): 16%

Safety Margin VS. Overload

TV Front Axle Weight: -760
TV Rear Axle Weight: -1750
TV Gross Weight (GVW): -920
TV Combined Weight (GCW): -1620
Hitch Tow (GTW): -6100
Vertical Load (Kingpin): -3150
Trailer Gross Weight (GVW): -100
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Old 03-19-2014, 01:26 AM   #3
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Couple of questions.

What is your gear ratio?

What is you hitch rated at?
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Old 03-19-2014, 03:46 AM   #4
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Ok... yes, that GCWR looks low for your truck. Should be more than that.

And not all sure about the calculator, but if you still have your 2 CAT scale tickets (for tow vehicle, and for tow vehicle + RV)... here's how you can figure it all out. Just substitute your numbers for mine.

Tow ratings for my 2014 Ford F-450, Crew Cab, Long Box, 4x4, DRW, with a 4:30 rear end:
2014 Ford Super Duty | View Towing Specifications | Ford.com

GCWR: 33,000 lbs

5th Wheel Tow Weight Rating: 24,700 lbs.

Ductchmen Voltage 3200 GVWR: 16,500 lbs.

Now here are my 2 CAT tickets... first for just my truck, and 2nd for truck & loaded RV. Though the dates are different, everything for the truck was the same on both weighs: full tank of diesel fuel, full tank of DEF, empty bed except for the 5th wheel hitch, and nothing in the truck cab but me.

Truck Ticket:




Truck + Loaded RV Ticket:




So my truck weighs 9,500 lbs... and my truck + RV weighs 25,420.

Since my truck's GCWR is 33,000 lbs, and I only gross 25,420... I'm good to go there.

Now, what does my loaded RV weigh by itself?

25,420 (gross truck & RV)
-9,500 (truck weight)
--------
15,920 (loaded RV weight)


So my loaded RV weighs 15,920... which is under the 16,500 GVWR, so I'm good there.

Those are really the only numbers I really care about. But if I wanted to know my pin weight, well that seems pretty simple to figure too:

Since the rear axle weight on the truck by itself weighed 3960... and the same axle weighed 6800 when the RV was hitched...

6,800
-3,960
---------
2,840 (pin weight)

If I want to know that percentage...

2,840 (pin weight) / 15,920 (RV weight) = 17.8% which is within the recommended 15% - 20% range.
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Old 03-19-2014, 04:02 AM   #5
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The numbers for your weights should be on the sticker on the drivers door jamb. The GCVWR should be in your Duramax diesel supplement of your owners manual. Use the above example to figure it for your truck and forget that flawed app. You already weighed it, that is the hard part.
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Old 03-19-2014, 04:40 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macman83 View Post
Use the above example to figure it for your truck and forget that flawed app. You already weighed it, that is the hard part.

The app is not flawed at all. It is an amazing tool if you have the correct numbers entered into it. The problem I am seeing is possibly he has entered an incorrect value for the GCVWR on his truck. Plus he is somewhat over the GWR of the trailer.
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Old 03-19-2014, 05:13 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arlan in arizona View Post
Couple of questions.

What is your gear ratio?

What is you hitch rated at?
Arlan and Tom,
Thanks for making me dig a little deeper.

Gear Ratio: 3.73
Hitch Rated at: 20,000

I finally found what I think is the correct GCWR for my truck in the Duramax Diesel owners manual. The GCWR is 30500 instead of the 20500 that I found on the Fifth Wheel ST web site.

That makes my report look like this:
TV Weight W/Trailer Attached: 12440
TV Weight: 8880
Trailer Kingpin Weight: 3560
Trailer Gross Weight: 22580
TV and Trailer Combined Weight: 31460
Vertical Load (Kinpin): 16%

SAFETY MARGIN VS. OVERLOAD
TV Front Axle Weight: -480
TV Rear Axle Weight: -2055
TV Gross Weight (GVW): -560
TV Combined Weight (GCW): 960
Hitch Tow GTW: 2580
Vertical Load (Kingpin): -1440
Trailer Gross Weight (GVW): 3580

If I am reading things right I need to unload 3580 lbs from the trailer.
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Old 03-19-2014, 05:41 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATCguy View Post
And not all sure about the calculator, but if you still have your 2 CAT scale tickets (for tow vehicle, and for tow vehicle + RV)... here's how you can figure it all out. Just substitute your numbers for mine.
I did as you suggested and all the numbers agree with the App Calculator now that I have the correct GCWR of 30500.

Thank you very much for your help.

I can not imagine how we are going to get rid of 3580 pounds of stuff.
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Old 03-19-2014, 11:22 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slb5146 View Post
I can not imagine how we are going to get rid of 3580 pounds of stuff.
Anyway to simply transfer, say, 2000 lbs of it to your truck? It appeared you still had some capacity to use there. Either in the rear of the crew cab, or in the bed below the rails & forward of the hitch?

Just a thought...
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Old 03-19-2014, 07:02 PM   #10
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What in the world do you have in your trailer. Your GVWR is 20,000 per Voltage, that's with a cargo capacity of over 4,000 pounds. Your data says you're several thousand above that? I'd be rechecking the numbers -there's a mistake somewhere.
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