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Old 11-07-2015, 04:24 PM   #1
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Power issue need some help

Hi all
My 3305 has shore power plugged in and everything was running fine last night . Left furnace on as I towed home to winterize and warm everything up.
This morning no furnace running no lights on thermostat and nothing on the board works, lights, pump, genny start up etc.
The microwave shows power as does the light on the tv. No lights work anywhere throughout.
Any ideas to try?
Out right now but will be home in an hour.
Appreciate replys.
Thanks
Rob
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Old 11-07-2015, 04:26 PM   #2
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Also
Is there a relay or reset somewhere?
I reset main breaker but nothing .
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Old 11-07-2015, 04:27 PM   #3
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Is there a relay or reset somewhere?
I reset main breaker but nothing .
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Old 11-07-2015, 04:37 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walker1 View Post
Hi all
My 3305 has shore power plugged in and everything was running fine last night . Left furnace on as I towed home to winterize and warm everything up.
This morning no furnace running no lights on thermostat and nothing on the board works, lights, pump, genny start up etc.
The microwave shows power as does the light on the tv. No lights work anywhere throughout.
Any ideas to try?
Out right now but will be home in an hour.
Appreciate replys.
Thanks
Rob
Sounds like battery is dead, you pulled it home with furnace on? Propane furnace? Check voltage on your battery. If the electic appliances are working must be battery. The converter has a fuse I would think. Check output of that unit to make sure its working the charger is built in, the lights throughout are 12v. Along with furnace, dc side of refrigerator so on..
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Old 11-07-2015, 04:44 PM   #5
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Check all battery connections, ground and so on. Sounds like a converter issue. Check all connections and fuses associated with it.
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Old 11-07-2015, 04:51 PM   #6
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I will check those .
Wouldn't battery be charging since it is plugged into shore power all night?
Batteries were good yesterday as I used them to power genny for landing gear and such .
However I sid notice on board showing evens that batteries showed empty last night whe plugged in? Found that odd.
Have new new 6 volts.
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Old 11-07-2015, 04:52 PM   #7
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Thinking converter too.
May have to pull and check the back after I try the other first.
Thanks for your suggestion.
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Old 11-07-2015, 05:44 PM   #8
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Yeah, it sounds as though everything running on 12v power is dead... but your 110v power items are working (microwave, tv).
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Old 11-07-2015, 06:41 PM   #9
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Sounds like the converter. Check the breaker for the converter and make sure it is not bad. Then check the converter itself. It is behind the wall in the basement. It should be a silver box. It has 2 automotive 40 amp fuses in the front. Check those. Confirm 110 volts to the plug and if all those pass the converter crapped out.


Mine did on the last trip of the year. I currently have mine out and it is a WFCO 9875. It has a 2 year warranty, so I'm going to get it replaced and keep the replacement as a spare. I'm going to order a Powermax PM4b-100 this week.
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Old 11-07-2015, 07:39 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by walker1 View Post
Also
Is there a relay or reset somewhere?
I reset main breaker but nothing .
Chack your fuse panel in your TV,

I had the same thing happen. My 12V systems would drain the batteries in a day or twe while we were towing and boon-docking. When we were set up for a stay, I used to hook my portable solar panel upto the batteries, the generator this there just in case. It's ten years old and I'll wager we haven't got much more than 100 hours on it.

I run the generator the batteries charge up again and off we go. Next day, Same thing.

I in the interm I had added my solar panels and off. we go to Alaska this year, never had a problem for over six weeks on the road.

I get home decide it's time to upgrade the suspension and brakes. When I hooked up the Electric over hydraulic module and no power. Start checking the batteries, all good, check the brake wiring, all good.

After about and hour I phone the Titan help line. The gentleman nailed it first thing, he said check for voltage at the trailer connector on the 12V circuit. If you have no voltage check to ensure that; a) there is a fuse on the 12V side, as sometimes they don't put them in, even though you have the tow package. b) if there is a fuse check that it is not burnt out. In my case the fuse was burnt out.

I haven't got any idea how long the fuse had been bad, because my solar was masking the problem.
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Old 11-07-2015, 09:47 PM   #11
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I would wager that the WFCO converter has crapped out. Mine did it just recently. No 12v output whatsoever. Charged the battery using a stand alone charger and everything went back to working. Used the trouble shooting guide on the WFCO website, then called them. They wanted me to take it to an "authorized" service center for testing. If they (WFCO) decides it isn't covered under warranty (takes them 4-6 weeks) you are on the hook for the service center labor ($165 an hour) as well as a new converter. I opted to go ahead and replace mine with a better unit. I went with a Progressive Dynamics 4 stage from Best Converters Great people to deal with and prompt shipping. I have discovered over the years that most warranties aren't worth the paper they are written on. WFCO is one of them.

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Old 11-08-2015, 05:10 PM   #12
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I agree on the converter issue probably being an issue.
Found a few things out.
Ran a separate power cord to my battery charger and the two 6 volts are fully charged now.
My 30 amp receptacle I wired into garage uses 120 volt. I use a pigtail to attach the 50 amp cord for trailer.
When on the 30, all things work but it seems any receptacles that are not GFI do not work. The blue light 50 amp cord attaching to trailer does not light up either.
Now the interesting part.
The pigtail I use has the trailer 50 amp attached to the 30 cord going to the service via extension cord that is 30 amp. This pigtail also has a 15 amp that I plugged into another extension cord going to another receptacle in my garage.
Now everything works!
Seems it is getting 120 volts on both lines giving 240???????
I thought the trailer only required 120 volt ?
Still wondering why my batteries went dead when plugged in. Converter issue?

Do you think the trailer needs charged batteries even on shore Power?
My last 2 rigs did not require this?
Still confused but can now run things and winterized,
Thanks for all replies.
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Old 11-08-2015, 05:38 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walker1 View Post
Hi all
My 3305 has shore power plugged in and everything was running fine last night . Left furnace on as I towed home to winterize and warm everything up.
This morning no furnace running no lights on thermostat and nothing on the board works, lights, pump, genny start up etc.
The microwave shows power as does the light on the tv. No lights work anywhere throughout.
Any ideas to try?
Out right now but will be home in an hour.
Appreciate replys.
Thanks
Rob
Quote:
Originally Posted by hddecker View Post
Chack your fuse panel in your TV,

I had the same thing happen. My 12V systems would drain the batteries in a day or twe while we were towing and boon-docking. When we were set up for a stay, I used to hook my portable solar panel upto the batteries, the generator this there just in case. It's ten years old and I'll wager we haven't got much more than 100 hours on it.

I run the generator the batteries charge up again and off we go. Next day, Same thing.

I in the interm I had added my solar panels and off. we go to Alaska this year, never had a problem for over six weeks on the road.

I get home decide it's time to upgrade the suspension and brakes. When I hooked up the Electric over hydraulic module and no power. Start checking the batteries, all good, check the brake wiring, all good.

After about and hour I phone the Titan help line. The gentleman nailed it first thing, he said check for voltage at the trailer connector on the 12V circuit. If you have no voltage check to ensure that; a) there is a fuse on the 12V side, as sometimes they don't put them in, even though you have the tow package. b) if there is a fuse check that it is not burnt out. In my case the fuse was burnt out.

I haven't got any idea how long the fuse had been bad, because my solar was masking the problem.
Did I misread the OP?

I read the problem being fully charged batteries when leading a site that had shore power and going dead over night, after towing home and leaving the furnace on over night.

If that is the case then it very well could be the TV 12V power supply tomthe trailer.

What I didn't see, was if the camper had been connected to shore power at home.

If that was the case I'll shut up.
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Old 11-08-2015, 07:42 PM   #14
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Did I misread the OP?

I read the problem being fully charged batteries when leading a site that had shore power and going dead over night, after towing home and leaving the furnace on over night.

If that is the case then it very well could be the TV 12V power supply tomthe trailer.

What I didn't see, was if the camper had been connected to shore power at home.

If that was the case I'll shut up.
I would agree with your assessment...if a GM truck, chances are that either the fuse is not installed (driver side engine compartment) or the wire is not hooked up to the lug or both. My 2005 DurMax had the wire taped up near the break booster...dealer said that not everyone uses the trucks for towing a trailer that uses a 12v power supply, SOP was not to hook up/install fuse, because it is another place for an electrical related failure to happen...

Cale
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Old 11-08-2015, 09:02 PM   #15
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Okay kiddies... trailer power basics 101

The 12 volt charge line should work while towing IF it was properly set up to begin with. Dealers are notorious for NOT putting in the fuses, relays or plugging things in. CHECK behind them. The 12 volt charge line from the vehicle is relatively low amperage, 7-10 amps maybe, I have seen as low as 4 amps on some due to wire size. Running high draw items or multiple items could pull the batteries down faster than the tow vehicle could put the power back in.

30 amp vs 50 amp. The 30 amp service is a single leg 120 volt service that powers the entire trailer.

50 amp is a 240 volt, however is split into two 120 volt legs when it hits the trailer. Most 50 amp to 30 amp adapters are only going to power one leg, or as walker1 found out, it takes two lines to fully power up the trailer when using an adapter.

Yes it is a good idea to plug the trailer in at home, to keep the batteries charged up, unless you COMPLETELY disconnect the batteries. Using the factory installed battery disconnect typically DOES NOT completely disconnect the batteries. On many trailers, here lately, the amount of crap pulling 12 volt current when everything is supposedly off is unbelievable. I was helping a buddy with a Forest River product. He was getting over 4 amps of draw WITH the battery disconnect switch in the off position. Seems the stereo, LP detector, cargo area light and something else we never found were wired on the battery side of the switch. In other words the disconnect wasn't fully disconnecting. At 4 amps his battery would have been dead flat in less than 24 hours.

walker1 you need to check and make sure you are getting voltage to the batteries when plugged in to shore power. If not you have a converter issue. It may be a bad breaker that the converter is wired into, bad connection, blown fuse on the converter, or a bad converter. If you have a WFCO and a Dutchmen product any of the above is an even bet.

Yes you need batteries/12 volt input. Your lights, refrigerator control board, water pump, stereo, and furnace fan all need 12 volts to operate. They get it from the battery(s) or the converter if it is putting out DC voltage like is is supposed to.

Class over. Now who has the beer?

Aaron
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Old 11-09-2015, 12:40 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by wahoonc View Post
Okay kiddies... trailer power basics 101
Most 50 amp to 30 amp adapters are only going to power one leg, or as walker1 found out, it takes two lines to fully power up the trailer when using an adapter. Aaron
Most 50 to 30 adapters take the one hot from the 30, and feed it to both sides of the 50. Like this one: 50 Amp 125/250V RV Female to 30 Amp RV Male Pigtail Adapter with Pull Handles - Furrion IP5431R-SB - Electrical Adapters - Camping World
However, because Walker1 "pigtail" has an extra 120 VAC plug, it is different. One side gets it's hot from the 30, and the other hot comes from the 20 amp AC plug. This type of pigtail is used to give two "hots" to a 50 amp trailer that has 2 Air Conditioners to run, in a campground with only 30's and 20's. But for home use, to keep the thing running on both circuits, including the side with the converter, use an adapter like above. Of course, trying to run both ACs with such an adapter will surely trip a breaker.
The ideal solution, however, is to upgrade your home outlet to a true 50 amp, 240 VAC circuit, thus giving 50 amps as designed to a 50 amp trailer. Then you know you have it "right," without adapters.
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Old 11-09-2015, 01:25 AM   #17
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Marty,
I am going to have to go and pull the two I have, but I swear they only feed one side of the circuit. Maybe I have a couple of duds? I have not dealt with the 50 amp stuff very often. All of mine have been wired with the 30 amp, and usually have been small enough I can get away with 20 amps or even less. With the Coleman I have never seen it peak over 16 amps, even with both the A/C and the microwave going.

Aaron
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Old 11-09-2015, 02:13 AM   #18
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Aaron, you and I probably both have the same 50 to 30 amp adapter, to plug our 30 amp plug into a 50 amp outlet. Yes, in that case, we are tapping into one side only. But in a 30 to 50, where a 30 amp outlet is used to power a TT expecting 50 amp service, it is different. In the last hour I cannot find a real wiring diagram, but several RV boards say the same thing. In an "adapter" such as the one I pictured, the single 30 amp hot is fed to both of the 50 amp sides. Thus, all the circuits in the RV will work, but limited at the pedestal to 30 amp (combined) max. The other type, with a separate 20 amp plug, or in some cases, two 30 amp plugs, are called "cheaters." For people who want to simulate the 50 amp experience, i.e. run two ACs, but without a true 50 amp outlet. These burn up pedestals, and don't produce the same wattage as a true 50 amp. Remember, the true 50 amp has 6000 watts available on each leg, (120x50), and thus 12,000 altogether, or 100 amps. But from my reading, the key is that the two sides share a neutral, but since they are out of phase, the neutral never has to carry more than 50 amps. Two 30 amp plugs, going into the same "cheater" could conceivably run 60 amps back through the same neutral. That's what burns these up and ticks off the CG owners. Just like it is with people, "adapters" are fine, but "cheaters" cause problems. IMHO! LOL
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Old 11-09-2015, 03:27 AM   #19
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Okay kiddies... trailer power basics 101
IF

Most 50 amp to 30 amp adapters are only going to power one leg, or as walker1 found out, it takes two lines to fully power up the trailer
Class over. Now who has the beer?

Aaron
First I ever heard this... thanks for the 101!
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Old 11-09-2015, 10:05 AM   #20
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Aaron, you and I probably both have the same 50 to 30 amp adapter, to plug our 30 amp plug into a 50 amp outlet. Yes, in that case, we are tapping into one side only. But in a 30 to 50, where a 30 amp outlet is used to power a TT expecting 50 amp service, it is different. In the last hour I cannot find a real wiring diagram, but several RV boards say the same thing. In an "adapter" such as the one I pictured, the single 30 amp hot is fed to both of the 50 amp sides. Thus, all the circuits in the RV will work, but limited at the pedestal to 30 amp (combined) max. The other type, with a separate 20 amp plug, or in some cases, two 30 amp plugs, are called "cheaters." For people who want to simulate the 50 amp experience, i.e. run two ACs, but without a true 50 amp outlet. These burn up pedestals, and don't produce the same wattage as a true 50 amp. Remember, the true 50 amp has 6000 watts available on each leg, (120x50), and thus 12,000 altogether, or 100 amps. But from my reading, the key is that the two sides share a neutral, but since they are out of phase, the neutral never has to carry more than 50 amps. Two 30 amp plugs, going into the same "cheater" could conceivably run 60 amps back through the same neutral. That's what burns these up and ticks off the CG owners. Just like it is with people, "adapters" are fine, but "cheaters" cause problems. IMHO! LOL
Yes, when using an adapter, we can run everything we want....until we run out of amperage... Some of us are lucky enough to have a system installed that monitors and load sheds when it senses being on a 30 amp circuit.

Is this a pic you were looking for?

Cale
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